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Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
Darknight
Posts: 1010
Location: NW Arkansas
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| Posted on 16-10-2006 14:20 |
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There has been some talking around the boards about after the Batman movies end, or how many sequels to Batman Begins there should be. I figured it might be interesting to throw out the question: How long should a series of character-based films last.
James Bond is pushing 20 movies (yes, I'm too lazy to look it up). I would consider Batman through Batman & Robin as a series. Ratner said that X3 was the end, but with the ending and some talk that I noticed in the latest Wizard, we may see and X4 in a few years.
How long do you think it should last?
Edited by Darknight on 16-10-2006 14:20 |
 
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
bluebeettle22
Posts: 254
Location: florida
Joined: 10.08.06
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| Posted on 16-10-2006 16:03 |
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i think 20 years for batman wud make it too long may be 10+
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
Darknight
Posts: 1010
Location: NW Arkansas
Joined: 26.06.05
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| Posted on 16-10-2006 16:31 |
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I guess I should have been a little more specific. How many movies would you put in that 10-20 year span, also what about X-Men or Superman? How many sequels to these superhero movies can they do without it becoming excessive.
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
Razhwurz
Posts: 1672
Joined: 02.08.06
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| Posted on 16-10-2006 17:09 |
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For Batman, I'd say six in the Nolan series is what I wish for; we already have five from three differant directors and we've barely scratched the Franchise's potential.
X-men should be two more movies; one for Onslaught and one for Apocolypse.
Spider-man should go out at 3, because most of the stories carried over from one and two look like there going to end in three; and three looks like a hard act to follow.
And I believe Casino Royal is the 21st Bond film, but I could be wrong.
Never start with the head; the victim gets all fuzzy!
R.I.P. Heath
Edited by Razhwurz on 16-10-2006 17:25 |
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
Phil
Posts: 2061
Location: Gotham City
Joined: 30.07.05
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| Posted on 16-10-2006 17:26 |
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i really doubt there will be 6 nolan movies. maybe 6 batman movies total(starting from begins)...i'll bet he will stop at 3, and some other director will direct the sequel to the sequel to the dark knight. lol, how wordy.
http://batmanytb.com/pictures/thumbnails.php?album=4 |
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
bluebeettle22
Posts: 254
Location: florida
Joined: 10.08.06
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| Posted on 16-10-2006 18:11 |
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yeah well for the x3 i think the mvie shud have been longer and based on fatal attraction and at the end magneto rips the adamantium out of wolverine and in x4 apocalypse give it back like in the comics, in the but an x5 i think that wud overeact the franchise.
and for bats i think just three movies if they made a fourth one it wud be like shumacher
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
batboy99
Posts: 1550
Location: Toronto,Ontario Canada
Joined: 20.10.05
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| Posted on 16-10-2006 18:14 |
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in my dreams i would never end it haha,but since bale is signed for 3 movies,there will probably be 3
oh and speaking of x4,i probably wont have the characters most of us want,it will probably be the youngsters since they are all sined on for future movie(s?),jackman,berry,marsden,and my fav actres famke janssen have not signed for future movies and said they wont,so there fore no logan,ororo,jean or scott
Batman YTB is the best site on the net!
Edited by batboy99 on 16-10-2006 18:17 |
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
Razhwurz
Posts: 1672
Joined: 02.08.06
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| Posted on 16-10-2006 20:53 |
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Actually most of the main actors from the previous X-men films have expressed interest in coming back for a fourth, they're just not signed up.
And Batman is one of the few comic franchises that I think can go on for a while; it has a gigantic amount of memorable villains, and an almost infinite amount of stories to draw insperation from.
Spider-man is the only one that I think should end after the third film. The three most recognizable and story effecting villians, Green Goblin, Doc Ock and Venom; are all looking to be used up after the third, and to follow them up with Scorpion or Shocker would be anti-climactic. The only two films I can imagine them making would be Carnage or the Sinister Six; other then that it would be like following Al Ghul, Joker and Two-face with with the Ventriloquist.
Never start with the head; the victim gets all fuzzy!
R.I.P. Heath |
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
bluebeettle22
Posts: 254
Location: florida
Joined: 10.08.06
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| Posted on 16-10-2006 21:39 |
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oh yeah that's right i forgot to tell you thta in the 4 the x-men who died will return (rumors) but at the end of x3 xavier -------- well it is a big major spoiler you shud see the end
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
Darknight
Posts: 1010
Location: NW Arkansas
Joined: 26.06.05
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| Posted on 17-10-2006 10:16 |
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bluebeettle22 wrote:and for bats i think just three movies if they made a fourth one it wud be like shumacher
Not necessarily, it seems like Warner Bros. is actually putting some thought into what they are putting out with Batman on it. I have never seen it happen, but I think that it is possible for a fourth movie to be released in a series and still be good. Hollywood has just not managed to make it happen.
Spider-man should probably be ended with 3. The more I think about it, the less I like how things have been handled. Every villain has been killed, it is suffering from the same thing that the Batman movies had in the 90's. Green Goblin had to die because that parallels the comic story, but it was silly to kill off Doctor Octopus.
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
spencer1984
Posts: 1271
Location: Upstate NY
Joined: 30.06.05
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| Posted on 17-10-2006 11:08 |
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There seems to be an interesting phenomenon with comic movie series where the magic number is 3, and the overall quailty goes 2/1/3. Pushed beyond that, things tend to fall apart for whatever cosmic reason. For example:
Superman was considered an amazing, groundbreaking film. It spawned Superman II, which is considered by many people to be a superior movie in many regards - less "set up" time, better villains, etc., etc. Superman III came out, and while is was inferior to the two before it, there were some elements that made it a worthy successor. Then, when Superman IV came out, things fell apart completely. It was generally panned by audiences and critics, put the entire franchise on hiatus for nearly two decades, and the fallout was so bad it pulled S3 down with it.
The same thing happened with Batman in the 1980s and 1990s. If we had never seen Batman & Robin, I doubt people would be so put off by Batman Forever. It was an inferior but enjoyable sequel, but when taken into the overall context we could see that it was the beginning of the end of that series, and hated it for that reason.
This "good/better/OK" model seems to have followed through with Blade and The X-Men, and I'm curious to see what happens to Spider-Man. It seems like with any of these series that if they stop at three, audiences in general will consider them good trilogies. If they force a fourth installment, it could risk pulling #3 down as well. |
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
real-dark-knight
Posts: 726
Location: The Shadow Of St Albans Abbey
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| Posted on 17-10-2006 15:23 |
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I like the idea of 3 films.
Maybe it's some sort of Star Wars thing, but a "trilogy" works for me. I think X-Men has worked brilliantly and I don't have a problem if they leave it where it is. However, if a number 4 proved good, I don't suppose for a second I'd complain.
Re Batman; I personally think it's hard to imagine that whatever follows from now will be as good as Batman Begins. I'm hopeful (for sure), but Begins is going to be so hard to top! If Spencer's theory of 2/1/3 proves to be true (thus the next film being even better) then I for one will be thrilled.
I like SpiderMan a lot - but the films just don't really do it for me. I don't know why but they just don't. I've seen them, own them and don't think they're bad; but I don't think I've watched the DVDs more than once each. If I'm in a Spidey mood then I'll definitely go for the 90s animated version (or just a book!).
And if you again take Spencer's theory - I think both Hulk and Fantastic Four were film number number 3!
Edited by real-dark-knight on 17-10-2006 17:57 |
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
Razhwurz
Posts: 1672
Joined: 02.08.06
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| Posted on 17-10-2006 19:43 |
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Darknight Wrote: but it was silly to kill off Doctor Octopus.
I think they did it so he could redeem himself; if it ended with Ock going off to become a villian at the end then they'de have to ignore the decent like-able Otto Octavious they had already established. However, alowing him to sacrifice himself to save New York form his own invention has more emotional weight.
spencer1984 Wrote: There seems to be an interesting phenomenon with comic movie series where the magic number is 3, and the overall quailty goes 2/1/3. Pushed beyond that, things tend to fall apart for whatever cosmic reason.
And the problem that has plagued us so far with the third and fourth movie in the series is the change of directors and writers.
Never start with the head; the victim gets all fuzzy!
R.I.P. Heath |
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
Darknight
Posts: 1010
Location: NW Arkansas
Joined: 26.06.05
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| Posted on 18-10-2006 16:20 |
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Razhwurz wrote:And the problem that has plagued us so far with the third and fourth movie in the series is the change of directors and writers.
I had never thought about it, but I think that Spider-man 3 will be the first time in comic movie history (albeit brief) that the same director has done all 3 movies of the series.
I had to double check Blade, but they had 3 different directors. We are all familiar with Batman. All 5 Superman movies have different directors (the Donnor cut to Superman II doesn't count). X-men probably would have kept Bryan Singer if not for Superman.
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
FlaBat
Posts: 1526
Location: Miami
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| Posted on 20-10-2006 20:19 |
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Star Wars seemed to set the tone for trilogies and other movies followed. Raiders of the Lost Ark and Jurassic Park stopped at three films. The trilogy works fro some, but not others. I?m waiting for Daredevil 2, although The Hulk 2 and Punisher 2 are in production (or will be soon). But not all franchises are that way, there are a few that break the mold.
James Bond is at 21 films, so that would be seven trilogies right? While some characters had the same actor/actress for them, Bond changed a few times over since 1962?s Dr. No. Honestly the storyline stayed the same. The world?s in peril and James Bond has to stop the problem.
Star Trek has 9 films most of them with the same actors since 1979?s Star Trek The Motion Picture. Star Trek more closely resembles Batman as it has been a live action TV shows, an animated TV show and feature films. Star Trek continues to reinvent itself with shows like Voyager and Enterprise.
Batman could be done the same way. Nolan could do three films with the cast he has and then somebody else could take over and do three more with a different cast and so on and so on. Batman has a huge library to choose from and could go on for years if done right.
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
Chris
Posts: 2999
Location: Richmond, Indiana
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| Posted on 20-10-2006 20:49 |
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Star trek.. could count, but after ST6, the cast changed, so maybe we do 6 films of Nolans Batman then move to Batman Beyond??? 
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
FlaBat
Posts: 1526
Location: Miami
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| Posted on 21-10-2006 08:50 |
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I was looking at Star Trek as a franchise. They have different timelines within that franchise, Original, Next Generation, Deep Space Nine, Voyager and Enterprise. So Batman could go that route as well.
I?d like to see Batman stay solo for a couple more films. I like the way he is now and don?t see a need to change just yet.
Then I want to see the Flying Graysons origin story and have Dick Grayson as Robin for 3 films based on the best Batman and Robin stories. We get to see Batgirl too, but not as much. She can get can get her own trilogy of films with Batman cameos. In her second or third film she?s gunned down by The Joker and becomes Oracle. This could lead to a trilogy of Birds Of Prey.
A Death in the Family could have Grayson?s departure as Robin and introduce Jason Todd with a condensed timeline of Todd as Robin leading up to the inevitable ending.
Then Batman is solo again for a couple more films and we see him anguished over Jason?s death and he kicks butt all over Gotham. Nightwing is in these films and he could maybe have a trilogy of films of his adventures before we see Tim Drake become Robin.
The Tim Drake Robin could be in a trilogy of Batman and Robin stores before he moves on to whatever becomes.
The Dark Knight Returns with a much older Batman would be great and if done right could lead into Batman Beyond for the last two films of another trilogy.
So that would be like 20 more Batman films which puts it on pace with James Bond.
So there you go WB I just laid out the next 30 years of films for you, so get cracking!
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
real-dark-knight
Posts: 726
Location: The Shadow Of St Albans Abbey
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| Posted on 22-10-2006 09:17 |
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As excellent as all that sounds Flabat, sadly I'll think you'll find it remains in your dreams!
Couple of things really do appeal - a Dick Grayson origin story, a sort of Robin Begins job, now that would be cool.
Also, if it all possible, I'd love to see a Beyond film!
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
Razhwurz
Posts: 1672
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| Posted on 22-10-2006 14:00 |
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Now the thing about these franchises is that every one has an image of how it should be; so as long as there is a Batman or Spider-man franchise and a film studio with the rights to it, there will always be a writer and director willing to make a new film.
Never start with the head; the victim gets all fuzzy!
R.I.P. Heath |
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RE: Longevity of a Character Based Film Franchise |
real-dark-knight
Posts: 726
Location: The Shadow Of St Albans Abbey
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| Posted on 22-10-2006 15:38 |
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I agree Razhwurz - but because of that, we got Schumacher's Batman & Robin!
But I guess it also (eventually) got us Batman Begins............
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